Motorway Services Online

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User talk:Johnathan404/Archive 1

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My Rating

Having sat at one star for quite a while, someone's rated me five stars. I'm flattered, I just wish you knew me a bit better! Johnathan404(talk) 20:42, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

East Bridgford

  • East Bridgford is an offical signposted services on A6097 so where does it fit? Check for yourself on Google Streetview 3/4 mile from junction. B.bill 17:30, 10 August 2011 (BST)B.bill 17:30 10/Aug/2011.
Sorry, perhaps I was a bit too quick to lay down the law there. To be honest I agree that it's an odd one which doesn't really fit in at all.

I can't find any signs on Google Street View, but I assume I'm missing something. Let's not forget that the situation here is probably changing as we speak, so it's probably best until we know for sure what's happening.

In the past including a-road services was only a test and I was happy that we only had lists of signed services on the A1 and the A34. Although we've added many more roads since, I think it still stands that it means no harm is done if some signed services on relatively insignificant roads get left out.

Having said that, it's not an area I know well and you've done a lot of work here so I'm happy to hear what you think. Johnathan404(talk) 17:44, 10 August 2011 (BST)

I see now! I suppose that qualifies it as an A6097 service area, though I wouldn't say it is particularly important or necessary that it is included. Johnathan404(talk) 18:03, 11 August 2011 (BST)

Woodal services:

It's funny that you have uploaded some pictures of Woodal Services because I was in the southbound amenity building this saturday! I even took a couple of pictures to upload here. I've noticed Welcome Break's idea of security by having too many of those security scanners that you get in shops. I could not tell why they had ones in the toilets. This photo explains what I mean: File:142.jpg

Yes it is an unusual feature to a MSA where most either do not have one or it is well hidden.

Anyway, I have been looking on this site as a visitorfor a few months and I could not help joining so I created an account knowing when I would visit one and I soon uploaded my first photos to the wiki! I am just sort of... Facinated by these services on how good various ones are!

Gourleyo 19:18, 21 August 2011 (BST)

Welcome to the site! I had to do a double-check for a minute as I took my photos on a Saturday, but it was the 13th. I was on the northbound side but went to southbound purely because I have too much time on my hands.
I guess between us we're only adding to the number of cameras at Woodall!
Johnathan404(talk) 20:30, 21 August 2011 (BST)

File source

OK, so I have decided to get around this by asking you to mabe delete the file of Bolton West when it was owned by the Kenning Motor Group. We are less likely to get in trouble if people look at the file in it's original location. Good luck!

Gourleyo 08:46, 26 August 2011 (BST)

Now sorted, sorry to trouble you! Johnathan404(talk) 15:37, 26 August 2011 (BST)

Moto Restaurant and brand names

Up until when the Eat and Drink Co. came in at some services Moto had a Little Chef, at some they had Fresh Express, at many they just had a Moto Restaurant. For their shops some had Scoop (A self branded name) but many just had an unbranded Retail Store. Do you know why this was?

Gourleyo 16:14, 6 September 2011 (BST)

When Moto services were owned by Granada, they all had a Granada-branded restaurant. Granada then decided to introduce Little Chef to the majority of their services: at some this replaced the restaurant, in others it was built next to it.
I thought the Fresh Express brand was then applied to all Granada restaurants, but where the restaurant was part of a large servery, that servery carried the name 'Moto Restaurant'.
I thought that Scoop was used in addition to the retail store at services with a large retail area.
Hope this clears a few things up! Johnathan404(talk) 17:12, 6 September 2011 (BST)

Fictional service station

Hello, Johnny! Today I have made an A road service station in Google Sketchup which is of a Little Chef and a Burger King. The link is here. What do you think of it?

Gourleyo 17:22, 17 September 2011 (BST)

Hello! Excellent, I've never thought of using Google Sketchup before, in fact I've never known anyone create 3D illustrations. I've created several fictional services before but these have always been in plan view. I've always joked that there should be an MSA video game, and you've just brought us one step closer! Johnathan404(talk) 16:48, 18 September 2011 (BST)

Re:Fictional service station

Johnny, your MSA video game idea would be great, esspecially for the PC. It could have gameplay similar to Sim City with a budget and a few advisors plus a new 3D interface which allows you from top to bottom create walkthroughs and people could come along and you could hover over them to read what their minds our thinking! There could even be a day/night feature and you could design it so the shop may be shut at midnight but open most of the day. I might have been able to make it if I was good at code. I am good at graphics but not neccasarily code. I might even if there was a version of this game have a few pre-installed models of existing services but change the branding to avoid copyright but still use the same room plan. The map below explains my top reccomendations for them.

<googlemap version="0.9" lat="51.483949" lon="-1.533966" type="map" zoom="4" selector="no" controls="large"> 52.057903, -2.14114, Strensham Originaly built in the 1960's, rebuilt in the early 2000's and has been a hit. 54.452527, -2.606313, Tebay One side opened in 1972, the other in 1993. 51.422551, -1.033401, Reading </googlemap>

Gourleyo 07:23, 19 September 2011 (BST)

I think there have been more than enough Tycoon games to warrant developing this one! Airport Tycoon is a good model. Johnathan404(talk) 16:30, 19 September 2011 (BST)

Site age

How many years ago did this site get founded? The forums go all the way back to 2005 however the user contributions and photos go back to 2009 and the page histories go back about 2 months.

Gourleyo 19:30, 19 September 2011 (BST)

In its current form, the site was founded in July 2007. This wasn't the first time I'd experimented with a website about motorway services, so some of the posts in the forums will probably pre-date this site as we know it.
The ability to edit pages was only introduced in December 2009, this meant all the content had to be moved on to a new system with the dates starting fresh. Some photos on here have been used on previous sites as far back as 2005.
To stop Site5 getting cross with the huge load we put on their server, the publicly viewable page histories are purged every couple of months.
Hope this clears a few things up! Johnathan404(talk) 20:16, 19 September 2011 (BST)

Roadchef history

I would imagine it was around the time of the new millenium but do you know the year that roadchef changed the funkier old logo to the more relaxed current one? Also do you know how long they have had a branded restaurant for and when they started to introduce Costa Coffee to most of their services?

Gourleyo 17:07, 21 September 2011 (BST)

The latest document I have with their old logo on is dated May 2000, and the most recent use of their new one I can find is June 2003, so it was some time between then.

Roadchef have used their own restaurant for as long as I know, but it has changed names many times.

Costa was used by 2000, probably a bit earlier. That's the best I can do I'm afraid, otherwise the information would already be on the site! Johnathan404(talk) 18:19, 21 September 2011 (BST)

Old versions

When you say that in it's current form the site was founded in 2007 but starting in 2009, you could edit pages, before you could edit pages did the site use the same interface?

Gourleyo 19:28, 26 September 2011 (BST)

Pretty much! One of the earliest designs for the site is archived here, but this was a temporary adaptation of what was already available. By February 2008 the more familiar design had been introduced, and on the face of it very little has changed since (behind the scenes things are very different). Most of the differences you can see there are down to limitations of the software that archived the page. Johnathan404(talk) 19:52, 26 September 2011 (BST)

Swindon services - now open!

Today I have made a model, again using Sketch Up which is a fictional Swindon Services, located Westbound only on the M4 between J16 and J17. The link to the PDF walkthrough is [here]. It's infact caught fire so this is only supposed to be a bunch of prefabs. Also, on Wayback Machine are there any links to older websites you experimented with services (as you said a few responses ago that this wasn't the first time you had experimented with it). If not do you remember what they were called? Also when did you start taking pictures of MSA's? Gourleyo 15:00, 1 October 2011 (BST)

Bits of the old Take a Break site is archived here. A lot of my experimenting was done offline or behind a firewall. Johnathan404(talk) 18:03, 2 October 2011 (BST)

Messed up image

Hello, I uploaded an extra image I'd taken at Strensham a few months ago today and it appears to have messed up the recent pictures section on the main page and the thumbnails with it in but when you see the full size image it looks fine. Could you either delete the image or try and fix the problem. Gourleyo 08:58, 15 October 2011 (BST)

There's a problem at my end - one of the processes aren't happening properly when a photo is uploaded. I had the same problem a couple of days ago.
I'm currently working on it but can't be sure how long it will take as I don't know what the cause is. When it is fixed I will let you know but I'm afraid you will almost certainly have to upload your photo again. Sorry about this. Johnathan404 14:22, 15 October 2011 (BST)
I've come up with a temporary fix and removed your photo for you. It should work now! Johnathan404 15:42, 15 October 2011 (BST)

New plan picture idea for this site

I've thought of a way people could get to know the customer layout of services without visiting them or looking at internal pictures - the MSA Plan. This idea could go below the Facilities paragraph on the articles with it but not in a new section. We could if so make an upload form specificly for them but for now I've just uploaded an image to an (almost) derilict wiki I founded that was very empty. Here is the photo I made of Strensham South:

What do you think? If you think this feature is good we should only apply it for services which we know well and ones we've been to. Also was this the rough plan you remember of the Southbound side? Gourleyo 17:10, 15 October 2011 (BST)

Sorry to jump in, but that sounds like a great and really useful idea; perhaps you could even show how they have changed over time!?
The Strensham South Plan looks largely correct, but when I visited in August I remember a second Costa lounge near the entrance and the toilets (or the mens anyway) being on the other side; however I might be wrong!! :O I have made a plan but am unsure how to upload the photo.
Adpi 18:31, 15 October 2011 (BST)

Here we are, I've made a plan of how I believe it looked 5 years ago. I seem to remember that the Costa was up the other end with the Children's Play Area located in the servery.

Gourleyo 20:17, 15 October 2011 (BST)

Adpi, to upload a photo click on the links menu in the sidebar. Good luck! Gourleyo 07:16, 16 October 2011 (BST)

Here's the plan:500px

Something else worth thinking about - all councils will have plans for MSAs in various stages in their development, and many of them are available to view online in varying qualities. I save as many of them as possible.
I'm a bit cautious about this because I'm not sure what the case for it is, ie how people will benefit from it, bearing in mind that the site is getting quite unwieldy as it is, and this sounds like something that will be hard work to keep up-to-date. Personally, I think it would be more interesting to use it to show how services have changed over time, but there isn't much information available for that.
Having said that, I suppose it's quite like the station plans that National Rail have (with immense detail and accuracy) for every station on their website. I don't see any harm with giving it a go if you can be sure you're doing it accurately. Johnathan404 14:55, 16 October 2011 (BST)

Childrens play area

I seem to remember that a few years ago where one of the Costa's once was at Strensham Southbound was a former childrens play area. I believe it may have been removed when the site was refurbished in 2008. Gourleyo 14:16, 16 October 2011 (BST)

I don't know about that, but an outdoor play area had been proposed here since 2001. Johnathan404 14:55, 16 October 2011 (BST)

I mean a small indoor play area with a few toys and that's about it.

OK Diner

Have you ever eaten in an OK Diner. If so what was it like and have you ever passed one? Gourleyo 18:52, 17 October 2011 (BST)

I've never been in one, no - I've never had any reason to. I've driven past the one at Burton on the A38 if that counts, but to be honest I didn't even notice it at the time (this was before the days that we discussed such things). Johnathan404 20:18, 17 October 2011 (BST)

Forum error

Hello, I'm using this because the forums aren't working. What's happening is that you get this:

Parse error: syntax error, unexpected '<' in /home/tabmsasc/public_html/forums/cache/tpl_subsilver2_overall_header.html.php on line 212. Could you try and get them back up. I'm not sure if it's Site5 or not causing the problem. Gourleyo 16:38, 30 October 2011 (GMT)

Thanks for this. Not to worry, it was me pressing the wrong button! It should all be working now. Johnathan404 17:06, 30 October 2011 (GMT)


Johhny shall I still make the page for BT WiFi or not?? user:Rich

Good question, I suppose it's a judgement call.

How much is there to say about BT Wi-Fi? If it's only a few sentences, I reckon it will fit nicely on the wifi page, which is a bit short of content anyway. :) Johnathan404 19:31, 26 June 2012 (BST)

Moto WiFi

It's not Spectrum Interactive is it?? user:Rich

Yep, I think that's them! Although I was also half-wrong: I've just checked my phone and the network ID is indeed 'Moto FREE WIFI', whereas I could have sworn it was something else. Even so, you and me know it isn't really theirs. ;)
Aha, I see the WiFi page already said that - I was just responding to the new Moto Wifi page. Johnathan404 20:01, 6 July 2012 (BST)
I'll just leave it as Moto Free WiFi then shall I?? user:Rich
I don't mind - the situation wasn't how I thought it was! I suppose really Moto WiFi is the product people are using, so we should refer to it as such, in the same way that we call them Moto and not Moto Hospitality or even Macquarie Bank.
Although it does mean we're going to have to agree on a spelling of 'Wifi' :P Johnathan404 20:10, 6 July 2012 (BST)

Fresh Food Cafe

John mate, I like to make shit up to make us sound good :P User:rich 18:20, 21st July 2012

Sorry mate, it doesn't work like that. When we get caught getting it wrong - or worse still, lying - we don't sound good at all. It's unprofessional, and undoes all the hard work that many people have gone in to making this site professional. Roadchef, lorry drivers, journalists, and many more professions all come to this website for a reason, and I really don't want to lose them.
I know the situation with Fresh Food Cafe because Roadchef have told me (and I shared it in the forums and will add it to the main site later). The reason I asked was because I was quite surprised that Roadchef would make a decision on it without telling me. Fortunately they hadn't. Let's keep it that way, and keep it that way by not lying about them.
Sorry to be heavy-handed but "making shit up" is quite a silly thing to do; even Wikipedia would ban you for it. If you want to speculate, please keep it to the forums.
Thanks. Johnathan404 18:32, 21 July 2012 (BST)
Sorry John, that was a bit over the top and I'll try and keep my opinions in the forums :) user:rich 22nd July 2012 18.12
Don't worry about it. :) Johnathan404 19:44, 22 July 2012 (BST)


Alright Johnny, Could you delete three pictures I uploaded last Monday as they were too big for the site and have messed up the photos pages?? Cheers user:Rich 11/08/12 14.09 (GMT)

Hi Rich, I'm ridiculously busy this weekend but it was on my to-do list. As it happens I just logged in to do it and only saw your message afterwards! Johnathan404 00:32, 12 August 2012 (BST)

BP Ultimate

Okay then Johnny, I wont carry on with it :L user:Rich


Johnny, can you sort out the link to my Twitter page on my User Page, Thanks :) user:Rich 08/09/2012 21:13

Oh dear, looks like there's a bug there. It will only search for the Twitter link if you include a website. I'll have a look at that one later. Johnathan404 17:25, 9 September 2012 (BST)
Cheers Johnny :) user:Rich 09/09/2012 17:24

Strensham N Krispy Kreme (Texaco)

Why was the Krispy Kreme deleted?? user:Rich 12/09/2012 20:16 BST

It wasn't - it's still in the code. I changed it from being hand-coded to using the template, but the Texaco template wasn't set to understand Krispy Kreme. It would have disappeared from the page for two minutes while I updated the Texaco template, and it's back now. Johnathan404 20:27, 12 September 2012 (BST)
Ahh, sorry my eager eyes catch quick things like that, Sorry user:Rich 12/09/2012 20:21 (BST)
Keep those eyes peeled! :D Johnathan404 20:42, 12 September 2012 (BST)

Krispy Kreme Template for BP

Hi John, the template doesn't seem to be working user:Rich 17/09/2012 18:06 (BST)

Shell/Starbucks D/T template

Johnny, the whole Starbucks in the Shell filling station thing is misleading, they are not part of the filling stations, they are separate units user:Rich, 13/08/2013 23:17 (BST)

Good point, guess I got a bit carried away. I'll see what can be done to improve it. Johnathan404 21:06, 14 August 2013 (BST)

Edits tonight

Johnny, no problem, do we know who this BurgerKing is? User:Rich 21:13, 29 April 2014 (BST)

Markfield Starbucks

I didn't believe the Markfield building was closed completely so I checked the Euro Garages website to check and it said there was a Starbucks

Hi, thank you for your response. I understand. In a couple of hours I will have photos of the services online. See this as an unwanted lesson - the operator's websites are often the least accurate of them all! Johnathan404 (talk) 13:36, 7 June 2014 (BST)

Lymm Photos

Before you take down my photos, I have had permission from Pete from the GB Motorway Services app who sent me the photos and he said it was fine for me to upload them on his behalf. User:Rich, 22:13, 24 June 2014 (BST)

They're credited to Pete so you're already doing better than some of the photos I've had to remove. Thanks for the heads up anyway. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:04, 25 June 2014 (BST)

how do you rename your user page???

how do you rename your user page???Aust379 (talk) 18:25, 14 August 2014 (BST)

You can't rename your user page - it needs to be the same as your username or it won't be yours! If you want to change your whole username, let me know what you want it changed to. Johnathan404 (talk) 23:47, 14 August 2014 (BST)

ok can you change it to josh 106Aust379 (talk) 06:01, 15 August 2014 (BST)

Done. Johnathan404 (talk) 11:22, 15 August 2014 (BST)

could you delete my old user page pleaseJosh 106 (talk) 09:37, 19 August 2014 (BST)

how do you put a map on your page ????

how do you put a map on your pageJosh 106 (talk) 09:58, 19 August 2014 (BST)

Best way is to click 'edit' on the page of somebody who has it and copy their code! That's the easiest way to learn wikicode. Johnathan404 (talk) 21:41, 19 August 2014 (BST)

What happened to the wimpy logo I uploaded??????????

What happened to the wimpy logo I uploaded??????????Josh 106 (talk) 16:43, 28 August 2014 (BST)

Please read this. The same rules apply here. Quinny898 (talk) 17:11, 22 August 2014 (BST)
Indeed, thanks. Although I should add that nothing's happened to it - it's still there! Johnathan404 (talk) 08:00, 23 August 2014 (BST)

why are you editing my old wimpy logo?????????????????Josh 106 (talk) 20:25, 27 August 2014 (BST)

Because you keep listing it as a photo, and I am listing it as a picture, which is what it is. Also please read Quinny's reply to your comment above. Johnathan404 (talk) 21:20, 27 August 2014 (BST)

it has nothing to do with the photosJosh 106 (talk) 16:43, 28 August 2014 (BST)

Exactly. So it shouldn't be classified with the photos!

i am talking about the wiki link but sorry anywayJosh 106 (talk) 16:30, 29 August 2014 (BST)

Thank you. It's discussing the pitfalls of posting company's logos on other people's websites. Which we all need to be aware of! Johnathan404 (talk) 18:39, 29 August 2014 (BST)

Some questions for you

Why have you changed my images? Josh 106 (talk) 20:08, 13 September 2014 (BST)

This is the same as the comments on your page about the Granada picture. They are NOT photographs and should not be in that category - a photo is taken with a camera. This is what the 'normal' box is for on the upload form. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:59, 15 September 2014 (BST)

They are no comments on my page about the Granada logo. Josh 106 (talk) 17:13, 16 September 2014 (BST)

What is wrong with motorway services info? Josh 106 (talk) 20:08, 13 September 2014 (BST)

We cannot use our webspace to advertise other websites I'm afraid! Johnathan404 (talk) 20:59, 15 September 2014 (BST)

Right I get it. Josh 106 (talk) 17:13, 16 September 2014 (BST)

why are you editing my user page

Hey why are you editing my user page ?

I have done nothing wrong Josh 106 (talk) 16:57, 26 September 2014 (BST)

Not a clue. I was on my phone and didn't realise I'd hit that one. My apologies. Johnathan404 (talk) 18:37, 26 September 2014 (BST)

Its okay I am trying to manage Josh 106 (talk) 19:13, 26 September 2014 (BST)

PS Cobham Eat In is a Welcome Break site. Johnathan404 (talk) 18:39, 26 September 2014 (BST)

I did not know that sorry. Josh 106 (talk) 19:13, 26 September 2014 (BST)

are you still on sabre??

are you still on sabre??? Josh 106 (talk) 11:21, 18 October 2014 (BST)

Yes I am. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:17, 20 October 2014 (BST)

Spam on the forums

Hi Johnny,

There's some spam on the "MSA news" and "Brands and Operators" which redirect to porn sites. There's about three views on each post and they are all by different accounts. Bmf1027 (talk) 08:36, 11 August 2015 (BST)

Lomondgate photo

Hi there, would you mind deleting the failed photo (the one that didn't show) of Lomondgate which I uploaded last month? Thanks!! Bmf1027 (talk) 23:26, 30 August 2015 (BST)

Done. I'm not sure what was causing the problem but have fixed a similar problem which was caused by the site. Johnathan404 (talk) 11:56, 31 August 2015 (BST)

Fleet WHSmith

Does the southbound WHSmith have either Costa Express or Krispy Kreme? Barnaby (talk) 13:52, 14 January 2017 (GMT)

It definitely has Costa Express. I didn't see a Krispy Kreme stand but then I wasn't looking for one, and there is definitely Krispy Kreme over the bridge. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:14, 14 January 2017 (GMT)

Woodall Bridge

Hello Johnathan,
When I saw your edit about the BK/McD's scenario at Woodall with regards to the bridge (I apologise for not making that clearer; I know that Fleet will be the same when the bridge is re-connected to the southbound building), it reminded me of something. When I visited Woodall in 2015, there was a lot of work going on in the southbound building. This involved moving the toilets to an external portacabin next to the entrance and minimizing the size of the Waitrose store, I noticed that there was no bridge access to the other service area on the northbound carriageway. Do you know when this was reconnected? Thank you. Barnaby (talk) 20:17, 21 May 2017 (BST)

I think you've been there more recently than me! It wasn't me who set it as being fully internal. I do know that by April 2016 it still hadn't been connected. Johnathan404 (talk) 17:29, 22 May 2017 (BST)

Annandale Water Services toilet refurbishment

Hi there,

In case you're wondering, the information I added about the proposed refurbishment is definitely true as Roadchef actually told me in an email, because I had submitted a complaint about the terrible state the gents were in.

Another thing that may be useful information is that there is a seating area opposite the toilet entrance/exits that is painted a very bright green, possibly hinting about a previous brand occupying that space.

Viperinelight50 (talk) 00:08, 2 June 2017 (BST)

That's right (although Roadchef seem to be in a perpetual state of saying they're going to improve their toilets, this time they say they mean it). It has been a while since I've been to Annandale, but I believe the green was the restaurant Orchards. Johnathan404 (talk) 00:39, 2 June 2017 (BST)
That's quite interesting. *Apparently* the manager sent her "maintenance team" down to the toilets to remove the mismatched signage and all, and I'll be able to check in July. The manager also offered me a free Costa Coffee and cake, which makes me think that they actually mean it.
I only realised the other day that Roadchef has told several customers that Bothwell was supposed to get a multi-million pound refurbishment two years ago, and obviously that hasn't happened :) Viperinelight50 (talk) 00:47, 2 June 2017 (BST)

Key On A-Road Services

When I made the A507 page I originally thought you did an error with the key code but you just didn't put it on A-Road pages with few services. I have put the short version on the new A-Road page. Should I keep it as the short version or change more pages to have the long version. Lc73 (talk) 10:02, 12 July 2017 (BST)

It's only a short page, so it is fine without a key. A key would be twice as long as the page! Johnathan404 (talk) 16:39, 3 June 2017 (BST)

Strensham Picture Problem

I notice on the Strensham gallery, Oliver hyam and Rich have both posted almost the exact same pictures, with the exact same descriptions. It wastes space in the gallery and makes it look unprofessional, in a way. Could you possibly sort pictures out?

They are different photos, although clearly very similar, which isn't surprising considering they were stood next to each other when they took it! You're right that we don't need both of them, but equally neither of them is doing any harm. Johnathan404 (talk) 00:14, 11 July 2017 (BST)
Oh, I didn't know that! Sorry for causing any inconvenience =]

Viperinelight50 (talk) 00:16, 11 July 2017 (BST)

Updates on several services

I visited (or passed) several services areas on our very long road trip to Stoke-on-Trent. Each is different to a certain extent to how I found them last time I visited and how they are on the site.

Annandale Water

The dodgy signage is still there, but the lettering has been removed. I made an effort to check the overflow seating area and there is a golden plaque announcing the opening date, and it features the former RoadChef logo. Also, some of the bodged up signage is peeling away, revealing either the old RoadChef logo or the Annandale Water logo.


Didn't actually visit these services, but judging by the state of the sliproad and totem pole, it's in a pretty woeful condition.


Burton-in-Kendal has gone through a large refurbishment recently, changing the EDC into an M&S, reflooring the entire site, refitting the toilets and replacing some signage. However, the 'Staff Only' door next to the entrance still features Granada signage!

Cairn Lodge / Happendon

Signage is messed up as hell, with a 'Cairn Lodge' logo on the northbound signage and a minimalist green castle on the southbound.


Hamilton has been recently refurbished to quite an extreme, but that doesn't stop them from vandalising the walls with laminated notices! The entrance doors are still emblazoned with 'RoadChef'.


Did not visit this site, but the (hideous) bridge is peeling back to Granada red.


All signage on the M6 still features Poplar 2000 branding, except from one sign on the northbound carrigeway.

Viperinelight50 (talk) 20:10, 18 July 2017 (BST)

Are the signs you saw on the motorway or at the junction as if they are I think the Happendon page can be renamed to Cairn Lodge.

Lc73 (talk) 20:24, 18 July 2017 (BST)

Don't do that. The text on the sign still refers to it as Happendon and we will therefore refer to it as Happendon and will do until the sign changes. Barnaby (talk) 20:51, 18 July 2017 (BST)

Showing Direction of facilites

I noticed on the Heartshed Moor page you changed the eastbound and westbound only display but only on the shops and motel (even though it does not show up so you have to write it separately). I think on these types of pages you should not change the design halfway through a page, to keep with not just the sites consistency but that pages consistency I was just wondering what you think and if we should change anything else to that format on that page or change it back or do something else or just leave it. Lc73 (talk) 20:39, 28 July 2017 (BST)

Thank you for your opinion. I loathe the use of split lines for westbound and eastbound and have no plans to change the existing policy. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:48, 28 July 2017 (BST)

Julian Graves

Should someone now mention on the services page Julian Graves was at (I have forgotten it) like how Fleet mentions Café Kenco.

Also should we now remove the Julian Graves link from the brands page or the whole mentioning on that page itself. Lc73 (talk) 22:43, 28 July 2017 (BST)

Hamilton Services picture

Hi there, I noticed this photo is on the wrong page, as it is actually Bothwell. I can tell this because Hamilton no longer has the 'Welcome to Hamilton' signage which was placed on the left side of the entrance anyway, plus is also less wide at the front.

Also, I am going abroad via Newcastle airport which means we will be travelling via the A1, which could be pretty interesting.

Viperinelight50 (talk) 17:42, 4 August 2017 (BST)

I don't understand because the picture you've linked to shows adverts and ordering points for McDonald's, which Bothwell doesn't have? Johnathan404 (talk) 17:56, 4 August 2017 (BST)
I never noticed that... That must either be a back entrance to Hamilton, unless Bothwell sneakily installed a McDonald's in the last few months. Sorry about that :/ Viperinelight50 (talk) 22:13, 5 August 2017 (BST)
After conducting further research via Google Earth, I can confirm that I have in fact made an error and that is in fact the rear entrance to Hamilton which still sports older signage. I should really pay more attention in future! Viperinelight50 (talk) 22:29, 5 August 2017 (BST)

Bolton West services restaurant counter.jpg

Is this taken from "The Services" (that Peter Kay thing)? If so I have a slightly higher quality copy (in 576p video) and could cut any other stills out if you like --Quinny898 (talk) 00:00, 26 November 2017 (UTC)

Yes, we are able to take a small number of low-resolution stills, ideally without any actors, for the purpose of commenting on the set. The same goes with any old film. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:55, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

Annandale Water Services Toilet Refurbishment=


I recieved an email from Kerry Gibson, Operations Manager at Annandale Water informing me that the toilets will be completely revamped starting on 11 December 2017 and being complete sometime during April 2018. Apparently the showers will be extended as well which will mean a possible reconfigurement of the toilets.

I'll be adding this to the page so customers know that the toilets will be shut.

Viperinelight50 (talk) 22:12, 4 December 2017 (UTC)

The toilets will not be shut. It is a phased refurbishment. While this is good news for fans of Annandale Water, I don't see that there's anything here we can use - this sort of thing happens all the time I'm afraid! Johnathan404 (talk) 15:14, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
That's where you're very wrong. She told me they'll be REOPENING in April 2018 so they'll definitely be closed for a while. I don't want to start an argument, but I don't appreciate being put down when I have evidence from the manager of the place.
I can assure you full toilet facilities will be available during the refurbishment work, which is in line with other projects around the country. If the plans haven't changed since the copy I've seen (which is in the public domain), the change will be noticed most at the entrance anyway. Johnathan404 (talk) 18:56, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
Please note I recieved the email yesterday. Here it is.

"Good morning,

I have been passed your comments through from our support office regarding the toilets.

The development works are going to begin on the 11th December and we, are hoping to have this finished by April 2018.

The toilets will be getting a full refurb along with the addition of extra showers.

Thank you for continuing to stop off at our site and I do hope that you will continue to stop over at Annandale when you are travelling up and down the motorway.

Kind regards Kerry Gibson

Operations Manager"

If you're referring to a whole site refurbishment, I've heard nothing about that and it's quite interesting.

Thank you for this. I can't see anything to suggest the toilets will be closing for four months so I stand by my comments. It sounds like a standard refurbishment scheme. Johnathan404 (talk) 20:00, 6 December 2017 (UTC)


Hello, I've just re-edited Northway page and updated it, along with adding lots of content and info. Shouldn't it be called Astwick though, as it only has a BP forecourt who call it 'Astwick'? --MMA (talk) 19:47, 24 October 2018 (UTC)


Hello, I've just re-edited Northway page and updated it, along with adding lots of content and info. Shouldn't it be called Astwick though, as it only has a BP forecourt who call it 'Astwick'? --MMA (talk) 19:47, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for your updates. A-road service area names are often contentious and in general I loathe to rename them because we should be using the popular name. In this instance seeing as the surviving petrol station says 'Astwick service area' above its own door it would be silly not to move it. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:44, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

Roadchef Stafford South

Thanks for tidying up my update! Just thought I should sign-up and contribute to this informative site after spending a few hours reading the lengthy planning documents for both of the Stafford South proposals on the Stafford Borough Council website. The documents are detailed and interesting, including scanned letters from the Highways Agency regarding their preferred option, letters from local residents complaining about the later-abandoned idea for the rear access, and details of Hallam Land Management's appeal. Way more than I could totally condense into a reasonable length section on the page without rambling, but hopefully what's on there is a good overview.

I was interested in this one because I grew up very nearby, and have always wondered why the two services are run by different operators. I also always thought it was bizarre how Moto Stafford North is very visible with local access via the B5026, whereas Roadchef is almost completely tucked away. Walking up Pirehill Lane along the unadopted section, you can see the wooden perimeter fence and tree screening but nothing else - I think the planning department at the borough council certainly got what they wanted in that respect! The lack of local access to the site must make recruitment much harder for them than Moto though, who in my experience have always attracted a fair amount of people from Stone as staff. On the other hand you never hear anything about Roadchef.

Mrwish (talk) 20:52, 12 March 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for your work - I only came in to stress that this could have easily been a standard Granada pair of services, but ended up tidying a few other bits.
Most of the '90s MSAs will have documents like this on the planning portal (I vaguely recall the one for Stafford North has a list of other sites which were studied and ruled out?) - the problem is these documents take a while to find, they take even longer to read and you usually have to read it several times and make notes before you begin to work out the story! But it's always better to have the information on here than on a government planning site where nobody can find it, especially in cases like this where it answers a big question.
You're right that being able to get all the details in while still being succinct is a skill, and not one I claim to be any good at even after years of practice.
I'd be curious to know how the two operators find recruitment. It must be one of the only MSAs where staff can play the two against each other and see who offers the best perks. I should think Roadchef, if not both operators, will provide a minibus, so where their staff come from will depend on where the bus goes.
Johnathan404 (talk) 20:24, 13 March 2019 (UTC)

Images uploading sideways


I've uploaded photos of a few MSAs and have noticed that they are flipped sideways in the gallery, but go the right way when opened in a new tab. I have no idea why this has happened as I uploaded photos taken with the same phone in January with no issues.

Viperinelight50 (talk) 21:07, 7 May 2019 (UTC)

Hi there, it looks like the photos were taken with an iPhone facing upright. iPhones instruct all photos to be turned 90 degrees to the left, on the assumption that you were trying to take something in landscape. If you open the photo raw in some browsers or apps they will be able to tell what's happened and correct it, but when it's embedded into the website this wouldn't work or the whole website would end up tilted to the left.
You can rotate photos using iPhones in-built photo editor, but in future it's best to take photos in landscape as we're not taking photos of people. Johnathan404 (talk) 22:37, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
Ah, that would make sense, I didn't know about that. I Will note that in the future.

Viperinelight50 (talk) 23:20, 7 May 2019 (UTC)

That is much better, thank you. Johnathan404 (talk) 15:16, 20 May 2019 (UTC)